Same-sex partners to get fed benefits

[Beanstalk]

Freedom of religion is exactly the point. Freedom of religion also means freedom from religion. Do you feel everyone in this country should convert out some sense of gratitude? bull---t. Yes I have read some of the bible just as you have, by that I mean I doubt you have ever read the entire book just as most people haven't.
What research of history would you like me to do? This country was not founded on the principle of any religion being dominant, hence freedom. Here is a bit of history--

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]When the Founders wrote the nation's Constitution, they specified that "no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States." (Article 6, section 3) This provision was radical in its day-- giving equal citizenship to believers and non-believers alike. They wanted to ensure that no single religion could make the claim of being the official, national religion, such as England had. Nowhere in the Constitution does it mention religion, except in exclusionary terms. The words "Jesus Christ, Christianity, Bible, and God" are never mentioned in the Constitution-- not once.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The Declaration of Independence gives us important insight into the opinions of the Founding Fathers. Thomas Jefferson wrote that the power of the government is derived from the governed. Up until that time, it was claimed that kings ruled nations by the authority of God. The Declaration was a radical departure from the idea of divine authority.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The 1796 treaty with Tripoli states that the United States was "in no sense founded on the Christian religion" (see below). This was not an idle statement, meant to satisfy muslims-- they believed it and meant it. This treaty was written under the presidency of George Washington and signed under the presidency of John Adams.[/FONT]



In the hundreds of pages comprising Madison?s notes on the constitutional convention (and those of the others who kept notes), there is no mention of biblical passages/verses in the debates/discussions on the various parts and principles of the Constitution. They mention Rome, Sparta, German confederacies, Montesquieu, and a number of other sources ? but no Scripture verses.

In The Federalist Papers, there is no mention of biblical sources for any of the Constitution?s principles, either ? one would think they could squeeze them in among the 85 essays if they were, indeed, the sources; especially since the audience was common men who were familiar with, and had respect for, the Bible. The word ?God? is used twice ? and one of those is a reference to the pagan gods of ancient Greece. ?Almighty? is used twice and ?providence? three times ? but neither is ever used in connection with any constitutional principle or influence. The Bible is not mentioned.

In a May 8, 1825 letter to Henry Lee, Jefferson identifies his sources for the Declaration?s principles. He names as sources: Aristotle, Cicero, Locke, and (Algernon) Sidney ? he does not mention the Bible. Then again, the terminology in the Declaration is not specifically Christian ? or even biblical, with the exception of ?Creator.? The term ?providence? is never used of God in the Bible, nor are ?nature?s God? or ?Supreme Judge of the world? ever used in the Bible


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We could cut and paste all day but the fact is the founding fathers did not expect every citizen to be of one religion or any religion. This is what makes our country so great, hundreds of different religions living and working together in our society, free to go to the church, synagogue, temple etc. to find peace and comfort worshiping the deity they believe in and not fear being forced into a religion not of their choosing.

Thanks for the massive cut and paste, simply put this country was founded because of religious repression. The Church of England had begun too legislate many laws that did not allow, "Christian" Freedoms. Hence the exodus. Enter Plymouth Rock. Sorry to inform you but Christians were the 1st to step foot on the newly claimed Americus! Needed to dig just a lil deeper in your cut and pasting


Now as a born and raised Catholic, Now Pentecostal Christian, I have no fear of people having the FREEDOM to choose what they do behind closed doors. That?s between God and themselves.

 

[LuciferSam]

This country was founded on "THAT BOOK" Christians are the ones who opened this country up to allow you Freedom of Religion. You might want to read this book that you say is being thrown at you. And do a little history research. Its great to have these Freedoms in this country and it was Christian Faith that opened it. See Christians are allowed FREE WILL. God Bless you!

I'l humor you and pretend I believe that citizens owe a debt of gratitude to Christianity for an eternity because of the peculiar beliefs of some but by no means all its founders. So should we also be grateful for all mistakes that were made along the way, mistakes which were corrected, but mistakes nonetheless? It's an insult to everyone to imply that our rights and freedoms are a gift from the Christians. In fact I think The pac-Man pie chart should be crapping blood.

 

[Beanstalk]

I'l humor you and pretend I believe that citizens owe a debt of gratitude to Christianity for an eternity because of the peculiar beliefs of some but by no means all its founders. So should we also be grateful for all mistakes that were made along the way, mistakes which were corrected, but mistakes nonetheless? It's an insult to everyone to imply that our rights and freedoms are a gift from the Christians. In fact I think The pac-Man pie chart should be crapping blood.

OK then, what were the ones that came across from England? Wiccan? Think not, They were all Christians, so it would be safe to say that yes this country was founded by Christians. So insult or not, The fact remains, This country was founded on a Christian platform, Long before the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution was ever dreamed of. Americus was long before Mr. John Hancock and company.

And for those that really dabble in history with unbiased eyes, Homosexuality was acceptable by most cultures.

 

[LuciferSam]

OK then, what were the ones that came across from England? Wiccan? Think not, They were all Christians, so it would be safe to say that yes this country was founded by Christians. So insult or not, The fact remains, This country was founded on a Christian platform, Long before the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution was ever dreamed of. Americus was long before Mr. John Hancock and company.

And for those that really dabble in history with unbiased eyes, Homosexuality was acceptable by most cultures.

The point, which was lost on you entirely, is that we are under no obligation to maintain the personall belief systems of any of the individuals who founded our country. We are under obligation to adhere to the constitution. Nowhere in the constitution does it say we must abide by the personal beliefs of centuries old corpses. I refuse to pay a debt of gratitude to anybody's spiritual perculiarities, especially when they are f--ing dead.

 

[hnooe]

The point, which was lost on you entirely, is that we are under no obligation to maintain the personall belief systems of any of the individuals who founded our country. We are under obligation to adhere to the constitution. Nowhere in the constitution does it say we must abide by the personal beliefs of centuries old corpses. I refuse to pay a debt of gratitude to anybody's spiritual perculiarities, especially when they are f--ing dead.

Gosh Darn I love Lucifer Sam!

 

[poppy]

This country was founded on "THAT BOOK" Christians are the ones who opened this country up to allow you Freedom of Religion. You might want to read this book that you say is being thrown at you. And do a little history research. Its great to have these Freedoms in this country and it was Christian Faith that opened it. See Christians are allowed FREE WILL. God Bless you!

Thanks for the massive cut and paste, simply put this country was founded because of religious repression. The Church of England had begun too legislate many laws that did not allow, "Christian" Freedoms. Hence the exodus. Enter Plymouth Rock. Sorry to inform you but Christians were the 1st to step foot on the newly claimed Americus! Needed to dig just a lil deeper in your cut and pasting


Now as a born and raised Catholic, Now Pentecostal Christian, I have no fear of people having the FREEDOM to choose what they do behind closed doors. That?s between God and themselves.

Exactly which book were the Pilgrims holding when they 1st stepped foot to claim a land not belonging to them and help bring this new found freedom to the native people?

OK then, what were the ones that came across from England? Wiccan? Think not, They were all Christians, so it would be safe to say that yes this country was founded by Christians. So insult or not, The fact remains, This country was founded on a Christian platform, Long before the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution was ever dreamed of. Americus was long before Mr. John Hancock and company.

And for those that really dabble in history with unbiased eyes, Homosexuality was acceptable by most cultures.

They were not all Christian.

 

[30ashopper]

What is up with the media these days, they don't seem to be able to report anything with any accuracy.

Doing a search on Google and just skimming the first few sets of articles by Fox, AP, LA Times, etc.. shows a mix matched batch of reporting, most of it inaccurate.

I still don't understand what this "memo" does exactly, who it effects, and what the elligibilty requirements are.

 

[Beanstalk]

Exactly which book were the Pilgrims holding when they 1st stepped foot to claim a land not belonging to them and help bring this new found freedom to the native people?

The Holy Bible, KING JAMES VERSION

They were not all Christian.

Sorry everyone of the "English" Passengers were. They were from the Church of England. Only those that wanted to separate from the church were allowed passage, Their prime reason for leaving was to begin a NEW Church under Christian Rule and More Freedom by separation of the Church from the Crown. The Church of England lives today as it had in the past, Under the Christian Flag,

History lesson for the day.... Magna Carta

here is a law which is above the King and which even he must not break. This reaffirmation of a supreme law and its expression in a general charter is the great work of Magna Carta; and this alone justifies the respect in which men have held it.

--Winston Churchill, 1956

​

King John of England agreed, in 1215, to the demands of his barons and authorized that handwritten copies of Magna Carta be prepared on parchment, affixed with his seal, and publicly read throughout the realm. Thus he bound not only himself but his "heirs, for ever" to grant "to all freemen of our kingdom" the rights and liberties the great charter described. With Magna Carta, King John placed himself and England's future sovereigns and magistrates within the rule of law.
When Englishmen left their homeland to establish colonies in the New World, they brought with them charters guaranteeing that they and their heirs would "have and enjoy all liberties and immunities of free and natural subjects." Scant generations later, when these American colonists raised arms against their mother country, they were fighting not for new freedoms but to preserve liberties that dated to the 13th century.
When representatives of the young republic of the United States gathered to draft a constitution, they turned to the legal system they knew and admired--English common law as evolved from Magna Carta. The conceptual debt to the great charter is particularly obvious: the American Constitution is "the Supreme Law of the Land," just as the rights granted by Magna Carta were not to be arbitrarily canceled by subsequent English laws.
This heritage is most clearly apparent in our Bill of Rights. The fifth amendment guarantees
No person shall...be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law
Written 575 years earlier, Magna Carta declares
No freeman shall be taken, imprisoned,...or in any other way destroyed...except by the lawful judgment of his peers, or by the law of the land. To no one will we sell, to none will we deny or delay, right or justice.
In 1957 the American Bar Association acknowledged the debt American law and constitutionalism had to Magna Carta and English common law by erecting a monument at Runnymede. Yet, as close as Magna Carta and American concepts of liberty are, they remain distinct. Magna Carta is a charter of ancient liberties guaranteed by a king to his subjects; the Constitution of the United States is the establishment of a government by and for "We the People."
The Magna Carta confirmed by Edward I in 1297 is presented courtesy of David M. Rubenstein.

​

 

[Beanstalk]

I still don't understand what this "memo" does exactly, who it effects, and what the elligibilty requirements are.

Sadly neither does the Government!

 

[Beanstalk]

I refuse to pay a debt of gratitude to anybody's spiritual perculiarities, especially when they are f--ing dead.

Interesting concept! So another thread is do to start here I feel